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The team doesn't make any money on unsold tickets, so sell them for considerably less close to game time.
Look, I'm sure once the team gets to winning more often and certain players make a name for themselves to building will fill up more, but till then expect more of tonight. In the meantime, I'm gonna spend my hundreds of dollars on rent, car, tuition, food, etc, etc...
That night was embarassing and in the future denver, go support you team please, and btw i'll represent the TON of avalanche supporters here in vancouver in saying GO AVS!!!!!
It's a shame to see so many empty seats, especially when the Avs have a great young team and lots of fans across North America watching their games on NHL Centre Ice. I do have to say that I didn't see a lot of Avalanche merchandise in the stores though, which was diappointing - it was mainly for the Broncos, Rockies & Nuggets.
However, I have seen before somewhere that the Avs have one of the highest average ticket prices in the NHL. Perhaps the Buffalo Sabres' model of variable ticket pricing is the way to go in the future? I just paid $68 to sit 12 rows from the ice in the middle of the arena in Buffalo to watch a Wednesday game against Phoenix...but that same price would have bought you a ticket at the back of the upper bowl for a game against the sad-sack Maple Leafs on a Friday night.
Go Avs Go!
I find myself sometimes thinking really, really hard sometimes about my devotion to sports? I’m here on earth for only a blip in the scope of things. I’m gonna die. I’ve only got so many good years, too. I just have that golden middle part of life, and what do I do? I devote it to caring about what happens to a bunch of guys who care nothing at all about me, for the most part, guys who, a good many of them, should be financially set for life by playing this game – this game made up by some guys one day about a hundred years ago on some pond in Canada.
I find myself asking more and more: why do I care about sports? Honestly, why do I care? Unless I’m the one getting millions of dollars and unless I’m the one out there actually doing it, in the spirit of competition and the inner satisfaction actually winning the actual game I’m playing in can maybe give me, why do I care?
Just kidding, AD =) ... actually we're saving money now planning for a move, economy, working late all the time, etc. etc.
PS: Do I need a bibliographic footnote for totally ripping you off? Please tell me you're a man of humor... =)
Phrish
#2) Chicago is Friday night - which game would you choose if on a budget
#3) Netting behind goals is too disruptive (used to have season tickets upper bowl behind goal when money wasn't as tight)
#4) Management has not won me back yet, still have a feeling we're one trade away from May, Bertuzzi or even another over priced slow footed defense.
#5) Parking is overpriced
To the local Avs fans in the area: Fans like us so far away would KILL to see the Avs on home ice, how are you going to diss not only the team, but those dedicated fans from far away by not showing up and supporting them? Who cares if it's Phoenix or Florida??? I'd DIE to have home game tickets!!! Our distance obviously doesn't allow it, so would you all please, SHOW UP??? The boys are, why aren't you?
I bought a pair of season tickets for the first 8 seasons. The price per ticket the first year was $26. The price per ticket the last year was $58. They have enough of my money and I'm not about to pay through the nose to hear blaring music and overpriced food/drink with a hockey game on the side. My new TV works just fine for watching games, thanks.
I believe that Denver is one of America's truely great sports cities, certainly on par with a place like Boston. The one thing that a place such as Boston has on Denver is far more years of history and tradition and a more sizable population, especially when you include the very close proximity of other New England states without their own teams(Vermont, New Hampshire, Delaware, Maine, Rhode Island, Connecticut etc..)
Anyway, I was extremely disturbed to hear of the embarassingly low turnout for this exciting and good hockey team. Denver is far too great of a sports town for people to not show up and support the best team in the Western Confernce. Weren't the Avalanche the same team that set a consecutive games sellout streak? I realize the times and big names have changed but it's still the same market. Hell, the Rockies(baseball, not original hockey) upon entering MLB in 1993 shattered and destroyed every attendance record in the book, records they hold to this very day. It would take something pretty special to overtake the Rockies records set in those first few years. The Broncos have sold out every home game for 40 years and have a 35,000 person waiting list for season tickets. Yet, for some damn reason there is going to be a sea of black and yellow Steelers in the stands this Monday night(just as it was for the Cowboys game). Same thing when the Nuggets play the Lakers.
Colorado sports fans are some of the very best in the country so this doesn't make much sense. I'd really like to know what's going on(so would Marvin Gaye). I now live in Las Vegas so it's difficult to get a read on the sports climate without being in the community and watching how things unfold day to day. The first thing I would do is look into the marketing department's and find out who's not worth a damn at their job. The city of Denver is already at a disadvantage from the jump on a national level from factors ranging from stuff as simple as being in the mountain time zone to the media not being in any rush to familiarize or promote Denver players.
Uninterested fans, or fans unwilling to spend money on team's they purportedly love creates an even bigger obstacle in Colorado's attempts to be taken seriously and entrench themselves in the pantheon of elite sports cities. I can tell from your piece AD, this is quite bothersome to you as well. And I'm really upset that the players don't feel they're getting the proper support. The weak turnout certainly can effect their play, but also it shouldn't be how guys like Duchene and O'Reilly are introduced to a "first rate organization and fan base". Especially, when they travel to a packed house in a Canadian city or a place like Chicago. It's bound to make them jealous and wonder "what do we have to do to be liked and supported".
AD, please continue to hammer this lack of attendance story and we'll see if it generates some bodies in the seatsthe upcoming weeks. One last thing, I'm an insane Nuggets fan and I love the carte blanche they've been given from ownership. BUT, It sure would be nice if Kroenke stopped treating the Avs as the red headed step child. Well, maybe Cody McCleod.
Anyways, some possible reasons that kinda go along with other things you already listed...
All summer management spewed us crap about "rebuilding". Everyone expected a rebuilding team so those "casual" rich fans who buy season tickets, probably spent their money elsewhere.
When you decide which games and how many you're going to go to at the beginning of the year, how many fans would say "I want to go to the PHOENIX game!" no one says that...If I got to chose 20 home games to go to at the end of September, this game would not be one of them.
The world series was on so I imagine the people that usually watch the Avs casually tuned into that instead, leaving the real hockey fans instead of the general sports fans.
I'm not trying to excuse tonight, I was embarrassed. I felt bad for the players, coming home to that.
Oh not to mention the fans in the Budaj blog who had tickets but didn't go solely for the reason that Budaj was starting. Now THOSE are cruddy fans.
1. Injuries have been piling up, and we have started losing. Fans were thinking 2008 all over again;
2. Peter Budaj just isn't a draw card (regardless of his result tonight) so expectation was low;
3. The Coyotes. Enough said there;
4. Big name players haven't been making big name plays over the past week;
5. We have no REAL marquee type magical player like Sakic / Foppa around anymore;
6. Stan Kroenke has marketed the product and Pepsi Center really, REALLY poorly;
7. The "this is too good to be true" attitude was probably being thought of;
8. Overall Avs marketing / advertising is appaulling;
etc etc..
They are TOTALLY not my excuses. Heck, if I lived within 30-40 miles of Pepsi Center, I'd buy a season ticket. In fact, I live in Australia, and plan to get to watch my beloved Avs at some time.
Therefore, and as usual, you are right AD. The Avalanche family need to stand up and appreciate these kids busting their balls for us this season.
There should be no complaining this year. We are equal top of the whole competition, along side a team that boasts Crosby, Geurin, Malkin, Gonchar, Fleury, Staal, Kunitz, Letang, Goligoski and co.
To say I'm thoroughly jealous that you get to witness these events like you do AD would be a complete under statement, which leads me to your article about how you wondered why you spent so much quality time on this product the other day.
Consider this. If you COULDN'T have this product in your life, yet knew it was there, and knew how much it interested you, would you miss it?
You claim you are unbiased, and look at things from a balanced perspective regarding the Avs. No, my friend. You sir, are well and truly one of the Avalanche family. A family that should have had a LOT MORE relatives supporting it tonight.
Your point, was well made.
AD, if it is possible for me to watch the games in person, I definitely would show up.
2. we're depending way too much upon simply Anderson saving us all the time
3. ticket prices are very expensive - tickets, plus gas, plus parking, plus food, plus a meager souvenir for a couple people is a LOT of money
4. Wednesday isn't a good night to drive a couple hours and see the Avs
5. Why is Stastny getting that much money? He isn't producing. His ice time isn't following Sacco's rules of effort equals ice time. Our offense could be better.
6. Koci needs to grow a big Scott Parker beard
7. Duchene needs to channel more Forsberg
8. We need a Smyth type to get in the face of the goalies
9. I want to see Coach Sacco get mad like Coach Q did
2. I wish the ticket prices were lower. I generally sift through EBAY to find decent tickets (I got club seats w/ parking pass and food for $50/ticket)
3. On top of ticket prices, I have to factor in gas AND food AND parking
4. Did I mention ticket prices are ridiculously high and that I'm a college student? (even those specials are pretty high priced)
5. I honestly wish I could go to every game.
Look, I'm not a bandwagon guy -- I'm spending for the partial plan they have. But casual fans aren't swayed by success 15 games into a season, and they've still never heard the name "Duchene." If the Avs want to make people take a leap of faith, people need to be able to get in, get good seats, and get out for a lot less than $250-$300 a game. What family of 4 is going to drop $500 for this, no matter how good they are? Heck, I can't even *sneak* into the lower bowl when no one's there.
The Avs need to entice people to come back. Box scores alone won't do it. Gimmick promotions won't do it. Nosebleeds seats don't help. The Avs need to spur demand, but they won't, because it devalues their season ticket holder's investment. My guess: No solution in sight.
Everyone in Quebec City just puked after seeing that picture and I don't blame them. That's terrible...
so, bottom line, my main reasons for not being there tonight are:
my family does not have the money to spend on going to games now
i need to save all of my own money for my travel plans
my mother needs to be looked after and i really can't be running out to games and leave her to fend for herself
oh, and btw dater, i think maybe you really out to cut all of us fans some slack. i mean, i know tons of great dedicated fans who never get to go to games, just cause their budgets don't allow it. being a hockey fan shouldn't be like a country club -- you're a good fan if you have the $$$ to go to games, you're a lesser fan if you aren't able to shovel over the dough for tickets.
The perception is the Avs are an easy ticket to get so people don't feel like they have to have season tickets. But it is truly depressing that nobody believes in the team enough to come down and support them. Support is not cheering from your couch all the time. There are plenty of ticket packages and deals plus nobody said you have to sit in the lower bowl and in fact I had a great row 1 seat in the upper bowl and saw everything great. I understand not everyone lives in Denver or has the money to go every game but seriously at least try to make it to a couple. People should be banned from even thinking about playoff tickets if they didn't bother showing up once in the regular season. Every team has bandwagoners, it is the nature of the casual sportsfan. It is us who bother paying attention and going to the games in October and November who deserve to be called true fans. I really don't know what is going to change the attendance situation, sure the Avs could run more specials and lower the prices but I don't know if that is the permanent solution. People would still complain about parking and the $8 beer or the uncomfortable seats or the inconvenience. Real fans suck it up every once in a while and watch their team in person.
ETA: It sounds like there are a lot of out of town fans who read this blog and it shows the wide ranging appeal of the Avs. We probably are not the right audience to be directing this question. Those of us who read this blog daily are on the hard core side of fandom who are hockey fans and go to the games or would if it was possible. We need to ask Joe Sportsfan who is a little too attached to his couch.
The AVs will ALWAYS have our support but in this day you choose carefully for your entertainment $. We noticed tonite how low the attendance was. Phoenix doesn't rate @ the top of the NHL heap but we won't get into that discussion here!!!
Unfortunately, tickets are crazy-expensive here–it's worth the % difference to get good seats in the lower bowl.
That said--frankly, if I was in Colorado right now, I wouldn't go to the Phoenix game unless I had a season ticket. I'm not that interested in their team. I'd rather see almost any other team in the league. The only one of their players I am remotely interested in is Shane Doan. And I'm not that interested in Shane Doan.
Look, I'm sure once the team gets to winning more often and certain players make a name for themselves to building will fill up more, but till then expect more of tonight. In the meantime, I'm gonna spend my hundreds of dollars on rent, car, tuition, food, etc, etc...
bring the stanley cup to stanley!
Personally - I am a fan that originally followed from Quebec but I work and live in London, England. I would definitly be a season ticket holder if I were in Denver. I watch most games online though even if face-off time is 2:00 in the morning for me for games in Denver. I hope to be able to visit and attend a couple of games in february or march though.
That and I still think they should make games cheaper to attend. If everyone shows up during the puck pack and family deals, just have more of them..
As soon as things get a little better, we're there....
I feel for those of you that can't attend home games 'cause you live too far away. I lived in Arizona for the last nine years before coming back to Colorado this summer. Before that I lived in Breck ever since the Avs moved to the league, so even then it wasn't easy to go. Needless to say, I'm ecstatic to go to any games I can. I even went to two preseason games, which I didn't think I'd do.
By the way, the Avs are 10-0-1-1 in games I've attended.
What I did notice about last night was the utter lack of excitement from the fans in the arena. It was a Coyotes feed, but they showed the Pepsi Center fans a lot, and the announcers praised the Avs all game long. I'm really surprised more people don't show up. It seems like people are waiting for the Avs to fail. And yet...
Another thing I noticed is the lack of team apparel at the arena, at least from the shots taken during the game. The number of people dressed in casual "I want to look good tonight" clothes seemed to far outweigh the "I'm going to an Avs game to cheer them on" apparel.
BTW, as of 7:30 a.m. (central), the Avs are nowhere to find on the Denver Post main page--besides a link within the sidebar of blogs asking why Avs fans weren't at the game. So I guess we could ask the Denver Post: where is your coverage of the best team in the Western Conference?
I really thing the people in Denver are taking the Avs for granted now. I would do anything to be able to watch the avs games live. Instead I watch from my computer on NHL GameCenter Live subscription.
Our OHL London Knights team has better attendance then the avs did last night. That is sad in my eyes.
I don't know what ticket prices are to watch these games, but the prices advertised while watching the games are great deals in my eyes.
I do think tickets may not be selling because the avs don't have many players to sell. Sure the team is playing hard and they have some good young players, but there are no exciting Crosby or Ovechkin type players. Give it some time for the young guys to develop and become big names in the NHL. Then the fans will return. Either that or get Forsberg back to Denver ;). That will sell tickets!
I have two fantasy hockey teams and I liked to be informed. I get way more info watching on TV than I do attending a live game. Plus I have a DVR, so it only costs me 90 mins, instead of 4 hours (including light-rail time, etc).
AD - I hear what you're saying. Now that I'm 29 maybe I do need to show up a little more. But really, there's not enough value for the average Joe like me to attend a live game. Ticket prices are way too high and so is everything else at the arena. I will consider doing maybe 6 games a year, no guarantees tho.
As for everyone else, the Avs did take for granted some fans too much. Also, they terribly mis-managed the team and roster and tried to sell us inferior players (ARGGGH-nason, never forgive them for that one). The team has been on the decline for a few years. Add to that low expectations coming into the year and I think people planned ahead to NOT go to games.
That being said, if the team continues to win - fans will show up. There's a little lag-time involved here, so I think last night's embarrassment was a product of the piss-poor season we had last yr. Check back in after 3 months and I believe there will be much improvement.
Also, I don't like feeling dumb, and that's how a live game makes me feel. Stupid Hinder blaring at 200 decibels, people launching shirts into the stand, Cotton-Eyed Joe??? (where's the organ?), blimp only for "exclusive" lower bowl fans, roving reporter, street dancers or drummers. It feels like a freakin Discovery Zone or McDonalds play land in there. I don't care about any of that stuff. I just want to watch hockey and cheer for my team without being drowned out by some pop-singer.
Let's see how the Avs draw against the Blackhawks on Friday (also a game in their 14-game ticket pack)
People are struggling out there, AD, and *paying* anywhere from $10-60 an hour to watch something that's freely available on tv just isn't going to happen. Kroenke and co. have too long gouged Avs fans.
As a Winnipeg Jets fan and still living here...........my god.......show up to the dam games or you won't know what you missed!
And the closest the Avs come to my area this year is Pittsburg - a 3 hour drive, and stub hub has their tickets pushing 100 bucks for even the cheap seats. I'm not that rich... yet...
When I graduated college, I flew with my family out to Colorado to see the Avs play the Blues - in some pretty kick butt seats. I'd love to do that again - but for now I have to settle for being excited to see a team of hard workers instead of the common belief that a team of superstars will produce results (no offense to the Avs intended; I'd rather have a player classify themself as a worker instead of a "superstar.")
You are dead on when you said we did nothing to help dissuade the critics tonight. It was completely sickening in the stands tonight.
I TOTALLY agree that the Avalanche are poorly marketed. I've had many, many people tell me that they would watch the games and become more involved with the sport if only they could even watch it on TV. You've got to have cable to get Altitude and they wish they could see at least some games on non-cable channels - like they tell me, they don't have to have cable to watch the Broncos, so why should they for the Avs?
Let's see some discounts for lower-bowl tickets. I've got row 1 for the game on the 23rd and had to pay $205 for ONE SEAT. That is highway robbery! I do not like sitting in nose-bleed country to see the game as I can see the game better on my high-def TV.
Just my thoughts as someone who doesn't get to see them live or on television unless I go out there and watch live and pay premiums for tickets.
I really think some fans are getting priced out. Company tickets aren't even a realtiy for many anymore, because the companies have cut back on perks such as sports tickets, and, let's face it, quite a few people are out of work.
In addition to those factors, I think it's unfair to judge based upon a weekday game against the Coyotes. I think Gretz was their only draw and he's gone now. For my money, I'd rather spend the cash and the time on a more marqee match up thank you very much.
When you only get paid $10/hr (and that before taxes) $10 for parking, $5-10 for dinner out and $25 for a ticket in the nosebleeds basically adds up to a full days wages!!
I'd be there if the tickets were cheaper, or my job paid me more and I could afford to go. But until one or the other of those happens - I'll be watching from home. My one splurge this year was Sakic's retirement (and I still owe my friend money for the cost of the ticket).
(The crappy economy means that we almost all have to plan our tickets purchases in advance - I don't think anybody except guys getting paid about as well as those on the ice can afford to just go drop $50+ on whim to see a game a day or two out. And looking forward when the season schedule came out - why would anyone want to get tickets to see a game between what looked to be the two worst teams in the Western Conference?)
Also, I haven't been quite sure if their start has been a fluke or the real deal, and seeing how they respond to a couple bad performances (against SJ & VAN), I see that they're team-first, hard work & accountability, which will go a long way to doing well this year. So my reason for not going to the game isn't so much not believing in the team as it is economical.
This is a new phenomenon in Denver sports that started with the Broncos. We fell in love with a few players and the success they brought, and since they've gone the fire is out. Is anyone going to tell me that the Bronco games are the same since Elway and TD? There is zero comparison, and don't tell me it's the ticket prices. Tickets to sporting events and the fees that are associated with going to the game have always been expensive relative to the value of a dollar at the time.
In terms of the Avalanche, Denver fans fell in love with Sakic, Forsberg, and Roy, etc...and once those players were all gone they tuned the Avalanche out. In reality, nothing has been the same since Forsberg left the first time in 2005, the city never rebounded in terms of love of hockey. The Avs are an afterthought for most people in Denver, not just in terms of their lives but in terms of their sports fandom. It's very annoying. I watched the Capitals go from a nothing team to the hottest ticket in town since Ovie got to DC, and it pains me when Caps fans are singing their superiority to Avs fans, but we deserve it. We now have a new, exciting, young team, and we're not supporting them the way even the Caps fans did for their young team the first year Ovie was here. That is pathetic.
Denver sports fans are spoiled rotten from the success brought by the Avs in the 90s. If you think that Stan won't move the team you're crazy, he is shrewd businessman that wants to make money. The Avs are good, go support them, or they will be gone.
1) The Avs still have some of the highest ticket prices in the league, and they delivered for a whole year a terrible product. They slashed salary and the face of the franchise retired, but there was no corresponding drop in ticket prices. Drop prices to adjust to the economy and demand and the seats will start filling up, guaranteed.
2) The Avs do an inept job marketing the team. Why aren't there billboards or ads making it clear that this team has a new identity? New faces? The marketing department (I honestly could not tell you if the Avs actually have one) should be doing everything they can to put Matt Duchene, Ryan O'Reilly, Paul Stastny, Wojtek Wolksi and Craig Anderson out there so the casual fans get to know who they are. I've seen nothing.
Do these two things and in a few months the Avs will be playing to packed houses. AD you really should write a column lambasting Avs management instead of the fans.
Seriosly though, the MN Twins a few years back did this "get to know 'em" campaign which I thought was great, it was before Joe Mauer or any hint of name recognition for the team. I still have my get to know 'em button they handed out at the stadium
They haven't done a good job marketing the team and catering to hockey fans in Denver in terms of airtime on tv and radio. We used to have some good Avs coverage when they were on KKFN-we had a few hours of post game shows, discussions on morning shows, etc. Now when I'm driving home from the game we don't get that in-depth discussion and the radio morning shows talk about other subjects besides the Avs. So I think we aren't generating the buzz with the casual fans and major fans that we need. It's pretty bad when I get more information about my team from the NHL Network than my local tv sports report.
Just a point of clairification...I was in Section 334 last night. There were about 8 of us through the first period, then folks moved down to other seats. We are season ticket holders, were there before the game, through the first period, then moved down to the handicap section for a better view for the second/third period. I know it doesn't matter since most of the sections around us were empty, but when you mentioned my section I had to say something since we are there for most games :0)
They haven't done a good job marketing the team and catering to hockey fans in Denver in terms of airtime on tv and radio. We used to have some good Avs coverage when they were on KKFN-we had a few hours of post game shows, discussions on morning shows, etc. Now when I'm driving home from the game we don't get that in-depth discussion and the radio morning shows talk about other subjects besides the Avs. So I think we aren't generating the buzz with the casual fans and major fans that we need. It's pretty bad when I get more information about my team from the NHL Network than my local tv sports report.
Just a point of clairification...I was in Section 334 last night. There were about 8 of us through the first period, then folks moved down to other seats. We are season ticket holders, were there before the game, through the first period, then moved down to the handicap section for a better view for the second/third period. I know it doesn't matter since most of the sections around us were empty, but when you mentioned my section I had to say something since we are there for most games :0)
Yeah, if I had a dollar for every complaint I've had about the Avs' new radio home and the job they do with tangental stuff like postgame talk and just general promotion, I'd have enough for a pretty good steak dinner at Del Frisco's tonight I bet.
I'm not even sure the people who do the post-game talk show on 1510 even show up to the games much or not.
I love the Avs. Love 'em! I read everything you write, AD. I watch every goal on the Avs website. I listen to Avs games on the radio when I can. If money were no object, I'd have season tickets down low where it's possible to actually see and hear what's going on.
But two tickets to the so-called cheap seats, plus gas, plus parking is way too expensive right now. In fact, I no longer have cable TV.
Call me crazy, but eating is more important. And my time is better spent putting out one more resume in hopes this will be the one that gets me hired. The one that lets me resume watching Avs games like I did when life was much easier. The one that lets me stop worrying about where I'm going to sleep when winter comes and the Avs are in the hunt for another cup.
It's the money, of course. Having a new baby in the house means that priorities have to be adjusted, particularly around holiday time. Our family would love to go, but it's just not fiscally responsible.
Having said that, though, it doesn't mean we're 'fair-weather fans'. We have Altitude (or Versus on occasion) on for every single game. If we're not going to be at home, we DVR it. And we watch the pre-game, post-game, and read everything we can about this team. Our basement? Painted burgundy and blue with a huge Avs logo on the wall. Just because fans can't afford to go to a game, whether in Denver or in Nashville, doesn't mean they don't support their teams as much as they can.
Now that you've been nice enough to answer my question I suppose I should give your inquiry a response as well... for me personally I just moved here from Arizona. I was at the Coyotes home opener, then 3 days later I was driving my stuff up to Colorado. I'm still looking for a job now and just can't spend money on games right now. I did go out to a bar and watched the game on TV, as I don't have cable (or preferably satellite) yet either. I do plan on going to more games this year, and I was a tinge remorseful that I didn't get to see my surrogate hockey family when they made the trip here, but if I'm not mistaken there's still one more time the Coyotes will come out here. I don't really expect that to be a full house though... the Yoties just don't draw crowds... I guess that happens when it's nearing a decade since they've made the playoffs, regardless of how good their start has been thus far.
The Avs are riding a high right now, and it's all going to come to a crashing halt soon enough. People are afraid to spend a lot of money on hockey right now, because they know it's all a mirage. Also, Budaj was in net last night, and people were expecting a stinker. The fact that it wasn't a stinker had more to do with the fact that the Coyotes also are a mirage and aren't as good as their record either. With this game, you really had two bad team that are playing way over their heads right now. They will both be near the bottom of the standings when the season is over.
The Nuggets are the new darling in Denver, even though they haven't beaten a decent team yet this year. When the Lakers stomp them in a few days, you'll see the real Denver Nuggets. namely, a bunch of primma-donna wannabe's who think they can run with the Spurs, Lakers, Celtics, etc, but are not close to the same level. Portland is going to take the division this year, and the Nuggets will be lucky to pick up a seventh or eighth seed. Then they will be promptly bounced out of the postseason.
Another thing: Matt Duchene has not delivered for the Avs. People were expecting big things from him. he has 2 goals in 16 games. That doesn't get people excited. They've now realized that he's not going to live up to his high expectations that were set on him. He's overmatched in the NHL. He needed another season on his Junior team, but the Avs rushed him so they could sell more tickets. The team is winning right now, but people know it won't last.
It also doesn't help that people in this town aren't really hockey fans. They like the team when things are going okay, but they don't stick with the team long term. This is a football city, with basketball a distant second. Hockey will always be 3rd string here. It's the reason why Denver never had a team that survived (Rockies) and couldn't support a team until they got a ready made contender in the Nordiques. If Denver had gotten a standard expansion team, this city never would have accepted the constant losing that comes with actually building a franchise from the ground up.
There's the long answer.
As for as other national outlets giving more coverage of the Avs than us? Nope, don't think so.
I can spend $4 to see my Rockies, which I gladly will do. I would have to spend bottom line $30 to see the Avs...
Easy decision.... Its bad enough I have to get cable to watch them. If I didn't watch the Avs games, I would not have cable.
I hate to disappoint the boys, but when it comes down to spending the money to get my education, or go see the team that I bleed burgundy and blue for, I have to be responsible and stay up here in Fort Collins and watch the game on TV.
Until KSE takes a serious look at their ticket prices, I'll watch in gorgeous HD at home. With 41 home games, and attendance numbers in the 11,000 - 13,000 range, it's only a matter of time before supply (seats) and demand (butts) begin to see a correction.
By the way, I bought tickets to Saturday's Vancouver game, so I'm still faithful to our boys.
One of the reasons I think no one has shown up is that the Avs didn't do anything to reduce their individual ticket prices. They reduced ticket prices on season ticket and 14 game packages, but nothing on their individual tickets, the cheapest of which is about $27. They do have discounted packages like the family pack, which runs about $100, but otherwise they aren't passing on the discounts to the fans who want to go to games but really can't afford it. Now, drawing from the Sports Marketing class I took while at Metro State, what they could do to get fans into the game is have a promotional night to a game at the beginning of the week (say, for example, Tuesday nights) maybe once a month, where they offer $10 tickets in the upper level. Having more promotions like that, I think, would help. Families wouldn't feel as though they broke the bank on going to a game, college kids like anything that costs under $20, and even if you've been put out of work, it may not be an unreasonable price for something that will help you take a break from reality for awhile.
The other half of it is just as you said, AD. Denver is NOTORIOUS for being bandwagon supporters (unless it's the Broncos, and then they should be loved by everyone, by virtue of being the Broncos), and right now the Avalanche are second only to the Rockies in bandwagon following. And if you've followed the Rockies at all over the last 3 seasons, you'll know that you couldn't GIVE tickets away to a game in 2007, but as soon as they went 21 of 22 and made the playoffs, everyone came out of the woodwork. Same thing at the beginning of this year. They make the playoffs again, and all the "fans" want back on. It's kinda pathetic really.
But never fear, AD, all the Avs need to get people to show again are the second comings of Roy and Sakic and a trip to the playoffs, and everyone will want back on the bandwagon. Although, to be perfectly honest, folks, now's the time to hop on and enjoy the ride. It's not nearly as crowded as it might be in April.
It was a mid-week game against a team that can't sell-out their own lower bowl, let alone any seats on the road. The Yotes have enough trouble with local fans, lets not expect them to have many fans from anywhere else, having gone to a few games myself, I know a decent chunk of the Pepsi center upper bowl seats are sold to people coming to cheer on the opposition and not necessarily the Avs. Factor in the economy and people having to pick which games they want to goto, this game probably not big on their lists.
So in summation, if people had to pick and choose games to come support the avs, a mid-week game against a controversial and sometimes lackluster team is not a high choice.
To summarized: Sign Peter Forsberg and watch the attendance...if it rises, that's the solution...if it remains the same...sorry to say, and I'm a HUGE hockey fan that grew up in Minnesota...we suck as a hockey town.
Just my thoughts as someone who doesn't get to see them live or on television unless I go out there and watch live and pay premiums for tickets.
From a friend who just recently left the organization:
"Phoenix on a Wednesday ... no ticket promos ... no comps ... not part of any package ... classic "punt" game when they just said "F it." The only difference between last night and any other crappy game from the last five years is that the season ticket number is so low this season. Oh well. If they keep winning the fans will come back. The Blackhawks game tomorrow night will have a much better crowd."
Altitude, and their homeristic announcers and color commentators. Mike Haynes used to be awesome when he did games with Norm Jones doing color on the radio.
Now, Haynes has turned into a company man and his partner McNab is just as awful. They NEVER are critical of the team when it is warranted. I've been tempted many times to scream at the TV due to this.
I know the reason. They are employees of Altitude as well as the Avs players. But for God's sake. When a player makes an absolute bonehead play, the announcers are supposed to call the player out on it.
The overly positive attitude is just kind of sickening.
They're job is to call the game the way it's played. If the Avs are sucking it, then Haynes and McNab have a responsibilty to the viewer to state that fact. I seriously miss the Avs being on FSN.
I find myself sometimes thinking really, really hard sometimes about my devotion to sports? I’m here on earth for only a blip in the scope of things. I’m gonna die. I’ve only got so many good years, too. I just have that golden middle part of life, and what do I do? I devote it to caring about what happens to a bunch of guys who care nothing at all about me, for the most part, guys who, a good many of them, should be financially set for life by playing this game – this game made up by some guys one day about a hundred years ago on some pond in Canada.
I find myself asking more and more: why do I care about sports? Honestly, why do I care? Unless I’m the one getting millions of dollars and unless I’m the one out there actually doing it, in the spirit of competition and the inner satisfaction actually winning the actual game I’m playing in can maybe give me, why do I care?
Just kidding, AD =) ... actually we're saving money now planning for a move, economy, working late all the time, etc. etc.
PS: Do I need a bibliographic footnote for totally ripping you off? Please tell me you're a man of humor... =)
Phrish
Just one example of how things have gotten stale....Same music...same entertainment...etc etc.
They need to try a lot harder to be honest.
I had been listening to the game on the radio on the way home from work and I thought "wow it's very quiet". I guess I know why now. Kudus to the Avalanche for at least filling the lower bowl so it doesn't look too bad on TV.
One more thing: Avs tickets are as much as 50% more expensive than Nuggets tickets for seats us common folk can afford (i.e., not courtside or on the glass). Why would the "casual fan" choose the Avs over the Nugs when visiting the Pepsi Center?
One ticket to Avs vs. Oilers on Wednesday, 11/25... Sec. 366, Row 14 (endzone) = $25
One ticket to Nuggets vs. Raptors on Tuesday 11/24... Sec. 364, Row 15 (one section over) = $10
THAT's why, Dater. 25 bucks to sit alone in awful seats? Lower your prices Avs, and watch the fans file in. It's a bad economy, changes need to be made!
Also, stop equating attending games to supporting the Avs, its just a small part of it. I see plenty of Red Wings jerseys in the stands and we know those fans aren't supporting the Avs, and its obvious from the posts there are plenty of Avs fans that can't attend the games due to finances, distance, or other circumstances.
1) I live in Kansas city now (I see the Avs in St Louis twice a year and tickets there are $38 lower bowl!)
2) My family is still in Denver, so when I do come to town it's not to see Phoenix
3) Bad economy!! We need more offers for cheap tickets please
4) Can be a bit "uppity" at the can. When I yell and whistle people turn around and look at me like I'm nuts
It's called cheering for your team people
Love this team wish I could go to every game,sigh...
50.00 + (4*35.00) + 15.00 + 30.00 = $235.00 for a great evening of family fun.
I simply cant afford to spend that kind of money to take my family out for a single nights entertainment.
What about the family 4 pack nights? Well, that is still a $195 evening.
No thanks, not when I can watch the game from home with better seats for my monthy cable subscription fees which I already pay... It simply costs too much, I would own season tickets and go to every single game if I could afford it. The family and I put on our jerseys every game and sit around and watch the game shouting and cheering... But breaking the bank to support the team live is not feasible when you have car payments and mortgages to make....
KSE waited two years too long to finally drop prices; marketing is hardly to blame. They had "sellouts" for a few years even though they knew the product was getting worse. I was paying $50+ for upper deck tickets as part of 14 game package. Once people leave their season tiks they realize they can do other things and it's hard to get them back. Until this year I never saw any group ticket specials for the Avs through my large employer yet always could get deals on Nuggets tiks. Why is it that the Nuggets and Avs both have the same amount of home games but ticket prices for the Avs until this year were almost double those of the Nuggets; yet the salary cap of the Nuggets is twice that of the Avs. Is that subsidized by TV?
I split season tiks with a group and even look for other tickets through Ticket Horse but those fees are just as bad as ticketmaster. That's really the most disappointing thing. KSE will stick it to you one way or the other.
AD- your 8500 estimate is even a little high, I was thinking it was more like 7000- it was super sad.
I think it's important for you to remember that you cover a nonessential luxury. For someone with my earning potential, a few games a year is a serious investment. The product on the ice has very little bearing on why the seats are empty. If they increase marketing, fine, but they aren't telling me about anyone I don't already know about.
I WANT to see the games live, but I NEED to pay bills and keep a little extra on hand in case my job is the next to go.
And don't forget, not too long ago we paid less money to see Patrick Roy, Ray Bourque, Joe Sakic, Peter Forsberg and Rob Blake. There's a little sticker shock to paying more to see Marek Svatos. When you trade in a Rolls Royce for a Prius and still have a higher car payment, you feel a little like you're being taken advantage of.
But I really want to take this opportunity to get to this point ABOUT THE PHOENIX COYOTES. THEY ARE A DIRTY HOCKEY TEAM AND THE LEAUGUE CONDONES THIS!
The HEAD SHOTS to both Quincey and Duchene last night only reinforces what has been the modus operendi of this team over the last few years. EVERY TIME the Avs play this team, we end up with at least the potential of serious injury to several of our key players. Go back and check it out last year and the year before. The Phoenix Coyotes are the dirtiest, cheap shot displaying team in the NHL, and the League (Bettman et al) ought to put an end to it!
But NO DOUBT this team is worth going to the game for. They are working their arses off, forechecking like I haven't seen since before the lockout, and Andy has a Roy-like force field that is just uncanny. I don't think selling tickets is going to be too tough once everyone sees how special these kids are. Avs Management should couple a strong ad campaign marketing these kids with a LOUD announcement that they will cut their prices. But A.D.'s point is well taken. I'm going to save up a little, and will make it to at least one game in November, hopefully some of you guys will be there too. Adios, JM
Some of the other reasons I feel contributes to poor attendance are:
1. The lack of star-power. Back in the day fans could count on seeing Sakic, Forsberg, Roy etc. now its Stastny, Hejduk, and Duchene and Anderson. All good players but they don't have the star power of the original 3.
2. Lack of marketing, I barely see anything around town advertising the Avs.
3. Competition with the Nuggets, with money sparse, people can only choose one or the other, and since the Nuggets are championship caliber, people often choose them instead of the Avs.
4. Lets face it the Avs were dead last, last season. Fans are fickle, they aren't going to shell out money for a last place team. I know they are playing well right now, but who knows what will happen in a month. When the Avs prove over an extended period of time that they are a playoff caliber team, the fans will start to trickle back.
But honestly lets face it, the real issue is money. Stan wants people to pay ticket prices for a team that is consistently in the Stanley Cup like were in the 90's and early 2000's. But the fact is the last 3+ years we have been very average, but yet ticket prices remain the same.
I was there last night and was totally disgusted with the fan base for a currently great team. I know, 5 home games in, but they are leading the league and deserve support. My "officials" told me true attendance was 7000 and change. From what I saw, they were mostly newbies, too. I heard people in the row behind me discussing how the whole row was comped to them. 20 seats by about $100 each.
BALONEY, BALONEY, BALONEY so called die-hard fans. And I don't mean all of you. There are some excuses, but ticket prices, the fact that Stastny had a dry spell, or marketing isn't the problem. You are. Avid, die-hard fans make the games. I believe other parts of the country are in economic trouble, yet their attendance isn't a reflection of their economic woes. I'm not saying that one attends a game instead of buying baby formula. I'm saying that you get to a great game instead of dropping more than that at some Lodo bar watching it on TV. We've always paid high ticket prices. They have actually gone down since the lockout, if you buy the packages. You have, and will continue to get the shaft buying single games. And please, AD wasn't addressing people half-way around the planet wondering why you weren't at the game last night. There's always been starving students, too.
I'm not rich, but this is how I decide to support "my" team. As it is, I may miss 2-3 home games a year, try to hit a couple of road games, and I don't complain about my ticket prices. I've been paying relatively high prices for the Avs forever. I'd like to pay less, but it's not a deal breaker. I'd like to pay less for all sports tickets, but why they are so high is for another blog, another day. I sat through last season, literally, and didn't think twice about re-newing my tickets. I am a fan. I support the team. Which also gives me a right to bitch. Kind of like the voting thing.
I will also accept minimal excuses about the economy from corporate-land. Mostly, companies bought the lower bowl, second level and the suites. Use the 20-80 rule on the economy and we should have over 14,000 at our games. Companies do make those buying decisions in the summer, base it on previous experiences, expected results, and with the economy decided not to re-new. Corporate economies may continue to be suffering, but if they are still buying Broncos, Rockies and/or Nuggets season tickets, they should pick up the phone and buy their old Avs packages back, or at least trade down from the giant suite to the lower bowl. If the place is "full" for the Nuggets, it certainly should be for the Avalanche.
I apologize for the length, but this is really upsetting. I am embarassed for our team, our city, and for those of you with all the excuses. You know who you are. Yet, thanks for letting me get out of the parking lot faster.
I'm not sure blacking out the games is going to INCREASE fan support. When you piss off the fans, they will most likely turn away, not run to the rink with $200 in hand.
Again, attending a game does not equal supporting the team.
Also, here is a link from a little newspaper called the New York Times...http://slapshot.blogs.nytimes.com/2009/10/06/victoria-cup-match-a-barn-burner-in-zurich/
Need I say more? The NYTIMES link is from last month.
http://slapshot.blogs.nytimes.com/2009/10/06/vi...
http://www.hockeyarenas.com/fancost/fancostpage...
I just searched for tickets to Friday's game vs. the Blackhawks and the cheapest ticket I could find in the entire stadium was 38$ for the worst seat in the house corner balcony tickets.
There is no way the average ticket price for the Avs this season is only 40$ as stated in your "stats" if the worst ticket in the house is 38$.
I would love to go to every single game, but there is no way a college student can afford going to every single game. I'm lucky that I get to go to 5 games this year. I also shelled out an arm and a leg to go to those 5 games, giving up some other luxuries along the way.
But once it becomes easy (and cheap) to get a ticket, well, that's self-perpetuating, too. If you know you can buy a lower-bowl seat at game time outside the Pepsi Center for the same price as a third-level season ticket, you're going to do that instead. But since you haven't already laid out the money, and 6 pm rolls around and your kids have homework and the traffic is bad and you have a headache from work, well, it seems a lot easier to sit at home and save $250. You haven't already spent the money, so you don't bother.
That said, we (barely) hung onto our season tickets this year, and I'm glad we did. I think.
But the team is showing an ambitious attempt to reclaim the glory days and while yes, the tickets are pricey and yes, the advertising is almost as bad as DU's, there are still ways to get into the game cheap. You don't think they're going to offer cheaper tickets when nobody is buying?
Last night I was ashamed at the attendance for a team leading the western conference. It felt like we could have taken every person in the upper level and moved them down and the lower bowl would still be empty.
Hey! what about the local advertisements? tv commercials cost a lot. Billboards are more cost effective especially electronic ones! CHRIST! What is wrong with these people?? marketing 101! Pull some lists, build some offers/incentives and people will come!
I'm flying out early Feb. for the birthday as I do every year. Going to my 1 game a year against Edmonton! You better have these things fixed by the time I get there!
I'm thinking the Avs won't make any changes to their marketing until they achieve under a thousand to attend a game, even with a first place team.
I think it's sad that the players come home and have an almost empty arena.
I have in my lap a ticket to a PRE-SEASON game against the Kings. Section 301, Row 3, Seat 15. Sixty-two dollars. To see the last place in the west team play the second to last place in the west team in an exhibition game.
Check out the New Jersey Devils ticket prices. Student seats in the nose bleeds for ten bucks. And Kroenke wants forty?
FYI - writing for Versus is kinda like screaming in an empty arena. Garbage network with garbage service.
Another reason I wasn't there is that as a season ticket holder I can take tickets of games I don't go to and exchange them so that I can introduce friends and family to our great hockey team. One game against Phoenix (without Gretzky) and with Budaj in net just wasn't worth the drive for me, oh not to mention the world series was on also.
Now even though I'm a season ticket holder (sorry for my rambling) I have to agree that the prices of the tickets are ridiculous based on last year's performance. They should have dropped them, tried to sell the team as young and exciting (which we are) and then build the fan base back up.
Sorry Avs for not showing up for you when you've showed up just about every game for me.